Complaint with King County ( in WA state) Dept of Health at suggestion of Attorney General & a medical doctor who I know in my life.

From: David.Fleming@kingcounty.gov
To: notyet03@hotmail.com
Subject: Re: Fraudulent Psychic event and false suicide information given out at Hay House event by Doreen Virtue
Date: Wed, 17 Apr 2013 00:18:29 +0000

Thanks, Mary, for this note. I have forwarded it to our behavioral health folks here at the County so they can be aware of the situation. We may be limited in actions we can take.

From: Mary-Desiree Kramer [mailto:notyet03@hotmail.com]
Sent: Monday, April 15, 2013 07:03 PM Pacific Standard Time
To: Fleming, David
Cc: info@johnholland.com <info@johnholland.com>
Subject: Fraudulent Psychic event and false suicide information given out at Hay House event by Doreen Virtue

Dr. Fleming,

I am writing to file formal complaint with the dept of Health at the suggestion of the Attorney General's office and at the suggestion of practicing medical MD I spoke with about the situation.

On Sept 22,2012 in the City of Seattle at the Angels and Afterlife event speakers Medium John Holland and alledged angel medium Doreen Virtue presented and  I observed seeming blatant psychic fraud leading to potential endangerment of suicidal persons by Ms Virtue. Ms Virtue had a question passed to her by medium John Holland regarding situation where single mother of suicidal 20 1/2 yr old black male asked why her son was becoming suicidal and shared with us that her son had written a letter to her that had he had read to her in which he confessed to repeated thoughts of killing himself and almost taking action several times in the prior weeks but each time a friend just happened to call so he changed course.

Mr. Holland passed the question to Ms. Virtue telling us all that Ms. Virtue had doctorate degree in clinical psychology and clinical psychology experience. He stated she had two doctorate degrees.  He stated to us all that she was best qualified to answer the question. The mother had specifically asked for his insight. The mother  thought wisely that of the two Mr. Holland was the real medium and might be able to get true insight into the situation.  Holland during his psychic readings nailed them.

Ms. Virtue was so horrible at "reading" people  that some left  during the event while she was talking.  She was observed seemingly in blatant "fishing" technique where she was unable to get any kind of hit on the people she was reading and did actively engage them to try to get them to tell her what she then reworded and repeated back to them. I have never seen it done to such horrific levels before. One old woman stormed out almost running into me on my way to the bathroom declaring" The Bitch is a total fraud." She asked me could I not see the woman was not getting anything on anyone and person after person was telling her no over and over and that she was trying to make it fit when it wasn't. I confirmed for the very pissed off old woman yes that I was observing the same thing as she was regarding Ms. Virtue. I tried to get the old lady to see that at least Mr Holland was a real medium but the old woman could have cared less she wanted the angel medium to be real.

But Ms Virtue's bogus psychic game crossed the line into endangerment with her imparting false information on suicide while claiming:
A) To see and communicate with all of our angels in the room  ( over 700  people present)
B) To claim gift of mediumship
C) Claim of being Doctorate level clinical psychologist.

Dr. Fleming in front of 700 people Ms. Virtue did tell this mother of suicidal young son that " Those who talk of suicide do not do it. They just want attn. They need counseling, But they don't ever do it!"

The mother at this point had already told us that her son had written a letter he had read his mother confessing that he had repeated thoughts of suicide he almost engaged in completing except for the young man's friends by fluke of miracle of God happening to have called just when the young man was going to end it all. Ms. Virtue went on and asked the mother was there any drug use involved and the mom said no. She pressed no alcohol or pot. The mom said maybe some pot and then Virtue in front of us all declared that was the issue the low vibration pot! 

Next Ms. Virtue went on to offer the woman help. Help came in the form of a book given for free to this mother that Ms Virtue had written on the Mother Mary and it was passed to the woman with the declaration that Mary is the Queen of Heaven and she and her angels could help with this that this book if placed even UNREAD on the nightstand would help heal the energy of the home and the situation..

At no time did Hay House staff or John Holland stand to correct this blatant misinformation on suicide or the use of family tragedy/medical illness to be used to plug a product that could not do what it was claimed to.  Ms. Virtue's statements on healing properties of her book unread  constitute a healing claim that is untrue and  is a pure snake oil.

I went immediately to speak to the Mother of the suicidal boy. I did the best I could using my gifts as an intuitive and as a person holding a BS degree in Justice and Law Admin with concentration in Correctional Counseling with a minor in Psychology.  I have family and personal history with suicide tendency - my family has lost 2 persons to suicide - and I have worked as volunteer at one point in my life  on teen suicide prevention line.

The woman with the suicidal son was confused why I was even there for as she said the two famous mediums had entirely blown off any risk to her son's life!  I sat there doing my best to let anything and everything of my gift, training and life experience come through to stand against the fraudulent info on suicide and to encourage this mother to take action now! The older brother also had history of suicidal tendency. So this mother has had 2 of 3 sons become suicidal around the late teens early twenties. Their  father is of intense mood and that is why there is broken home. Family depression of suicidal level is medical & spiritual condition not caused by a little weed except to bogus  gurus making shit up as they go.

 I ask the health dept  to please stop Ms Virtue from making claims of Mary Mother book healing energy tied to suicidal tendency or any medical condition and  in making statements that could lead suicidal persons from not receiving help then need asap when she says those who talk of it NEVER do it! I ask the health dept to hold Hay House CEO Reid Tracey accountable for what goes on under the Hay House name. 

Melissa ,a Hay House employee who was present that  day , that she clearly saw that Ms Virtue was "entirely off in all her reading of all the people she read" and she stated she was shocked Ms Virtue "even attempted to read anyone." I was informed Ms. rarely reads anyone anymore.  I asked Melissa about the suicide comment she confirmed she had heard it clear as I had but she said " I only took it as dangerous if taken literally. It would be dangerous if taken literally." When I asked Melissa why if she thought there might be any harm why she did not stand to say this is wrong she said to me she was pretty sure had she done so had she thought it concrete risk  that she would have been fired on the spot.

Hay House CEO when I contacted him did state if I had the email of the mother he would personally write her and encourage her like I did to seek immediate medical attn. for her son. I have not the email of the mom at this point.

I can not say ethically that the CEO has offered to do nothing since if I had the email he would have written the mother to correct Ms Virtue's false info  but Mr. Fleming he did nothing to correct the false information that went out to 700 people who may not now get help for their suicidal loves ones or friends.  He has left 700 Seattle people hearing bullshit .That mother of the 20 yr old may or may not believe me that she should take the risk as real  of her son committing suicide if he keeps having repeated thoughts of it --all because Hay House CEO  & Louise Hay herself are comfortable putting  a seemingly completely incompetent fraud on the stage to milk believing souls seeking answers for millions in profits each year. There is not a thing spiritual about that.

Virtue clearly did not follow APA standards or Spiritualist standards or Christian standards in her answer to the mother of the suicidal son. From what I could try to evaluate with only limited info from the mother the son has 5 of 9 risk factors for teen suicide not including having a close bloodline relative of suicidal tendency or history. A little weed didn't make this kid suicidal..

Claiming the psychological degree at DOCTORATE level and failing to follow the truth of psychology made Virtue's statement seem like it is medical truth when it was is untrue.  Virtue if you read her books or hear her presentations has a history of making stuff up that makes little to no sense and not being held accountable by those in the metaphysical community. Whether its telling people to warn fairies off the grass before mowing so as not to kill them or of unicorns. I have never heard a of a story of an angel of God leading anyone to 5 marriages and 4 divorces. But even if you listen to Virtue she won't tell you about that aspect of  her life as she  tries to make it seem like she has one divorce..

Hay House stands to make millions on the Virtue angel crap between the cards, books, angel classes, angel therapy practioner classes, apps for iphone , calendars, and such and cares so little for human life that though Ms. Virtue clearly violated their rules about imparting of medical information, they did nothing to stop her from doing so. Stopping the angel medium from imparting dangerous medical info and claiming fraudulent healing claims on book she wrote would clearly show the woman is an utter fraud . The money is huge in Hay House continuing this fraudulent route and if no one takes this stand who cares little for the cost to their psychic career it won't change until someone dies!

 I've had a fellow medium from Van Praagh Mastering Mediumship class encourage me to not report the fraud, writing  that I should see Mr Holland's conduct as an example for me if I want psychic fame. I was told that psychics run in circles and that you don't out the fraud in your circle. I was told it's not right but its how it goes . I was told to play the game so that I too can have psychic fame as Mr. Holland. I am hearing Desiree you can't call attn. to the fraud it will affect our ability to make money. Mr Holland though a real medium - is no different than some cop or priest of good conduct  who see physical abuse or sexual abuse around and will not take a stand to stop it due to personal profit  thinking well I don't engage in it so its not my obligation to take the stand. Its wrong when priest turn away from reporting other priests who do wrong things. Its wrong when cops don't stop bad cops from hurting others & its wrong when highly gifted medium lets another whether real or fake give out bogus bullshit while they say nothing to stop it.  Human life matters.

 There are no incompetent angels .. but  there is angel fraud.

 Will you see what can be done under the law in this case.
I have waited months and done all I can to see if I talked Hay House and Holland would they step up to correct their psychic fraud problem and they have done nothing that I am aware and so it will probably happen again if not in our state in another. I have been unable to get solid commitment from Hay House CEO that he would guarantee this would never again happen.  I must morally press forward till I am sure no soul will be hurt in this fraudulent bullshit.

Mary- Desiree Krautkramer
Seattle WA